Alo and De Officials #59
(PD) Alo and De Lake on Land.
Copyright ©2018 November 7, 2018
Morning Dove: The elders are concerned of the ancient writings that appear to say that all people should give respect to government officials... words like 'respect great official'. We know that it is very easy for us to mistake ancient words, our giving the ancient words a modern meaning, which might not be a close interpretation at all, but... our concern is that the words appear to be, as if, perhaps a form of propaganda and a means of controlling the masses. Respect of good people is good and proper, but respecting a person simply because they have a government job, that is not good and proper behavior... that kind of behavior is destructive, wrong, ignorant, subservient, and, what appears to us, to be in a full contradiction of the book's other words.
Shan: All of the elders, we are all in agreement with Morning Dove. If the ancient words do say to honor and respect government officials, then the words are wrong, unacceptable, and cause us to question the whole of everything else, including the idea of junzi. Now, if it were possible that all ancient government employees were good men, of good qualities, of being like a junzi, then fine... but, if that were the case, then why use the word 'official'? Why not just say 'good men'?
Morning Dove: Also for words like 'bosom all noblemen'... the idea is too incorrect... not harmonious, not creative, it is merely being submissive, giving honor to evil men merely because the evil men have a material occupation... the behavior is irrational and cannot possibly be useful to create a good nation.
Alo: I am similarly concerned of the words... the words have repeatedly caused me to hesitate, and to question the whole of the ancients' writings. The words you mentioned, relate to three sentences... the first sentence speaks of giving attention to how things relate to, and are dependent, on the other... the words speak of studying what we might think of as 'closeness', or, vaguely, the modern word of 'related', as in how a thread is woven within fabric..
De: Appreciation, requires absence and presence...
Alo: Yes, excellent example... cannot attain appreciation of a thing, without first not having the thing... love is appreciated, because, first a person had no love. The ancient words, appear to have used the concept of 'weaving' as a word to point to how different things relate and depend on other things. The second sentence points at knowing how a person might use three weaves... the third sentence speaks of how all previous weaves act as how a 'heaven-under nation' uses nine weaves... create, respect virtuous person, love and closeness also, respect great official, group official also, children also, many workers also, gentle far people, and bosom all noblemen.
Morning Dove: So, then, the words appear to be speaking of the way of how a 'heaven-under' nation is formed... nine levels of woven strings... but still, to some of us, the emphases on respecting officials... yes it might be necessary for a nation to exist, that its people give allegiance to government officials, but blind respect also?
Shan: 'Bosom nobleman'... unless the ancients' idea of a nobleman was of a bright junzi, then, no... to us, a title of noble, or nobleman, a title given merely upon birth to a family that had also been given the title of social rank, no, unacceptable. That would create a nation of castes... royalty, nobles, citizens, and slaves... and, though, still similar today in our modern world, including the nation that we live in, still it is unacceptable, and most definitely not a way that harmonizes with Nature's way.
Alo: I very much agree to all that both of you have said... I might give a plumber a manner of respect that is due to a plumber, to respect his knowledge and skill of plumbing, but, I would not respect the man himself, nor his inner qualities, merely because he has an occupation of being a plumber. Similarly with all officials of all occupations... give a degree of reasoned respect to their job skills, but not give heart-respect to the individuals themselves merely upon the grounds of the people having a job.
Morning Dove: That could be agreeable, but what of 'bosom noblemen'?
Alo: That has also been my own hesitation... I can excuse giving respect to different occupations, based upon the respect being of a kind that is merely generous of recognizing a person's skills, but, to bosom an official or social rank of any form? No, I cannot do that, nor would I expect anyone else to do that, not even foreign people who might admire one's nation. And, so, at present, if the ancient writings were indeed coherent, then at present I am leaning to the idea that the ancient word for 'nobleman' might have implied a junzi-like person employed within a government position... I cannot yet imagine how a different interpretation could be reasonable...
Morning Dove: A junzi, holding a governing position... wow... yes, that would be remarkable... I cannot so much as imagine what it might be like, to have quality individuals employed in positions of government...
De: Cannot imagine, what has not been experienced...
Alo: Ha! Exactly!
Shan: Indeed, fully foreign to us today. I am sincerely trying to imagine what it might be like... a quality man, with a government job... unheard of today, not known to exist anywhere on earth!
Alo: It might be possible that the ancients' culture might have indeed had quality people in ruling offices, but, if that were true, then look at how far mankind has decayed... the ancients' culture, today, would be seen as if a heaven nation...
De: What the sentences said... heaven-under nation...
Morning Dove: Ha! Imagine, if you can, occupations that require quality inward natures, and not be able to be hired simply upon knowledge or family heritage, or social rank, nor because of bribery with money.
Alo: Yes, the idea, to us, simply seems to be all but impossible...
Shan: Then, let us say for the moment that the ancients did indeed demand a junzi-like quality before a man could become an official... then that would be a worthy goal for us today also.
Morning Dove: Yes it would... choose leaders, leaders of the nation, and leaders of small groups, based upon the leaders' inner qualities... not based upon force, greed, and lies... wow, what a wonderful thought... all but impossible to do, but, what if?
Alo: Also, see what we have done... we, far from the ancients... we bosom their noblemen...
Morning Dove: Oh, we did indeed... perhaps somewhat force-fitted into what the ancient words might have implied, but still, still we did...
Alo: The woven string... we appreciate an ancient junzi, because, we have no junzi here... the string, power, pulls upon the heart... appreciates, yearns for similar, distance increases appreciation, increases heart string power... bosom junzi, nascents... chidao...
De: Creativity... create, heaven-below nation...
Shan: Then, chidao is not merely a feel-good term...
De: Feel good, after harmony...